Thursday, December 2, 2010

Redneck fishing to back up a dubious position

One of the interesting things about my move to the Southeastern part of the United States is I have become reacquainted with the redneck section of the human species. My first experiences with rednecks came during the civil rights era of the 60's when a lot of us, even scared me, got involved and my University was not that long of a drive to Alabama and the heart of the debate so we went in numbers and protested and marched.

The funny thing was most of the rednecks were not that bad just highly misinformed. Most rednecks were just slightly better off than the black Americans they had been conditioned to hate and were the other side of cheap labor in the South which made the rich purveyors of the hatred even richer. It was no accident many of the leaders of the KKK were businessmen,  landowners, and farmers in need of cheap labor for higher profit. It is more complex than this simple explanation but this was a major part of it.

I am in a nice ethnically diverse middle class neighborhood down here in NASCAR Country and I have a good old boy redneck living next to me. His wife and I have become good friends and they had a BBQ late in the summer with my favorites and I commented the fish tasted very fresh and Larry, not the Cable Guy, said he had caught all the fish that very morning and I was suitably impressed because there was a lot of fish for the 20 odd neighbors that attended the BBQ.

I told his wife her husband must be one hell of a fisherman and she told me he couldn't use a fishing pole to save his life.  She said he goes redneck fishing and she takes me to the freezer in the garage and pulls out several sticks of dynamite and proceeds to tell me they go to the stream in a couple of boats and throw dynamite into the water with waterproof fuses and the explosion stuns or kills the fish and I learned about redneck fishing and I am not going near that freezer. Not that I ever have fished much but that would seem to take the artistry or skill out of the concept of fishing.

There are many activists that seem to follow a similar pattern when defending their positions only it is  fishing for facts to back a particular position. They throw spurious arguments and comments into their posts few of which are based in fact and if per chance they are called on it, assuming they allow themselves to be called on it, they just throw more dynamite into the process in the form of bullshit and hope they can confuse the issue even more or stun the readers and hopefully kill off the opponents in the process. This could be called the excessive bullshit defense also.

They even confuse themselves with this defense and might seem to switch opinions in the middle of a post or more often in the very next blog. They will then of course turn to deflecting the criticism by moving on to a different stick of dynamite.

Right about now I really don't have a side in this debate. I might have originally but after reading about others on here I may not understand some things but I cannot hate someone because they are different from me but I do have some opinions I will defend.  Now I realize the self-appointed power activists like Aria will take offense to my critiques of her and I do admit she really pisses me off at times but there are just times she confuses her flawed logic with being factual because she says it is so so it is so and there is no question I can do the same but I will try and correct my ignorance while she just throws more dynamite trying to hide hers behind the noise, smoke, and the bullshit she spews.

Now I can be pig-headed when I have an opinion and someone dismisses it with the dynamite or bullshit response because I want proof I am wrong if I am wrong. I believe as Benjamin believed that this is something inborn in us and that we truly are girls which Aria believes also except Aria wants to only let her kind of girls join the group. It is quite a simple concept actually when one looks at it logically. Our brains are wired female but our body has a birth defect. Benjamin and even Freud believed that.  Yes even Sigmund Freud thought we were born this way when he discussed it with Benjamin at a meeting in the 30's.

My opinion is quite simple. Since it is inborn in us then gender and sexual orientation are mutually exclusive and not linked but once awareness of one's sexual orientation arrives they must work in some form of harmony whether others believe it or not because we are sexual beings for the most part.  Now this can take the form of heterosexual, homosexual, or bisexual.

The other opinion I have is that the intensity of the gender discomfort based on the birth defect is not the same in everyone but in a transsexual it will eventually reach the point where the transsexual decides enough is enough and deals with it. The intensity or gender discomfort grows over time because we evolve and when children we have little idea about the vagaries of gender, sexual orientation, and whatever. We are children and we are confused by this discomfort but we are still children and parents and society can push us into doing stupid things to survive.

Depending on what happens as a child many can repress the issue which in my opinion is horrific for those individual children but at some point the gender discomfort or the transsexual condition will force itself to the front while it simmers painfully in their everyday life. Some say it doesn't but some are better at supressing it maybe because they were forced to internalize it.

For some the intensity of the discomfort prevents them from caving in to the pressures to be a good boy if you are MTF but all of us tried to fit in and that includes me. Some have other conditions that make it tough to fit in and maybe we were intersex but I certainly did not ask to be born both transsexual and with hormonal issues although the low testosterone was a benefit eventually it was not a benefit when you are a confused preteen or teenager.

For anyone to imply intensity is bullshit like Aria does falls flat on its face based simply on the facts and those facts sit in the diversity of this blog world and the totally different narratives everyone has and all the different time-frames when intensity forced the issue. Most of the really late transitioners come from my era because information and help were not available. I cannot imagine how difficult it must have been to live with that daily pain when you realize everything is a lie but they survived but some are scarred for life by it and the human brain is amazing in its ability to carry on.

I cannot pretend to understand how a MTF transsexual can marry a woman and have children but Benjamin believed it was possible and he saw many instances of it during his clinical research into transsexualism and I have several friends that have and it is nothing to be ashamed of but what does irritate me is because I liked boys and was transsexual I am or was somehow gay which is Aria's position. I did not live the other side of this so I am no expert on it although I think I understand it better now than I ever have.

My comments about her latest post were met with the expected response but one of comments illustrates the dynamite or bullshit defense she uses perfectly. She was asked several questions about what she said about me earlier, which I appreciate, and she answered none of them but used the dynamite approach to move in another direction.

She went on a rant against the Sexologist "experts"  and then equated them with slurs against gays and lesbians. 

The vast majority of these sexologist “experts” need to get the message that the younger generations do not consider gay or lesbian as a slur to be hurled. Most of the under 40 crowd has no problem with people’s sexual orientation and didn’t experience the level of shame or the social ostracization that older people had to endure.

As a result the younger generations generally do not have the same issues with sexuality. So the situation becomes very clear when someone is trying to shame and control others using their orientation as an insult. This is something that I have observed over and over, as I said. And it always comes from people who share that sexologist viewpoint that people need to sorted into bins based on sexual orientation. This is not acceptable.

Those people who want to “study” young gay boys need to find something else to do. The never got the message that being gay or lesbian is not pathological. Homosexuality was removed from the DSM almost 40 years ago, but go to the “Kurt Freund” lab and you’d never know it.

For what purpose do these people do “research” on gay/lesbian children and adolescents? This whole thing stinks to high heaven, and anyone who buys into that horrible garbage needs to be seriously questioned because that is an extremist minority viewpoint that should be extinct.

Excuse me but aren't you the one throwing around the terms "gay transsexual" and demeaning children that were effeminate as nothing more than "gay boys" and aren't you the one using "prehomosexual" which might be the most offensive word I can think of? You have continually pointed to these  studies of effeminate or feminine boys to propose your belief even those kids that are transsexual are really just gay boys. You have even used Person-Ovesey and their study to justify your preeminence as a "primary" transsexual or is it the only "true" kind of transsexual.

You are the "Chicken Little" of the transsexual world screaming the gays are coming to dethrone my womanhood or it is a transgender conspiracy against Aria. Transgenders are gay which is your favorite comment or at least one you bandy about and how is that not homophobic.  The very phrase is homophobic as you are even though you bite your tongue because many of your followers are lesbian.

Aria Blue says:

Lol, what’s Liz’s problem now? I stopped taking that person seriously after the series of gaffes they made with their story on the blog awhile back.
Not that I ever really took them very seriously in the first place. I don’t think whoever they are is very bright. They certainly can’t follow an argument or train of thought.
When questioned about the gaffes:


I’m not going to go into the gaffes, I’ll let the author of that blog try to figure it out. I do find it encouraging that the sexual-orientation-hierarchy crowd has retreated to Benjamin and his “psycho-sexual inversion” terminology. This is some real progress. We’re one step from doing away with this nonsense once and for all.
 I am certainly not immune to making gaffes but this is another example of the dynamite defense ass she fires the Benjamin comment and I am afraid it is Aria that has issues with following her own argument and if she has a train of thought it is scattershot at best and is based entirely in her paranoia.




For clarity, my goal is to narrow the definition of “transsexual” to a single birth condition just like “Klinefelter’s”, or any of the other congenital intersex phenomena. I want to see “transsexual” narrowly construed so that only those born with that specific condition appear as TS in the medical literature. The wide application of “transsexual” to anyone who is “gender variant” or happens to pay for a sex change has done nothing but harm to everyone involved and created fodder for the sexologists. That’s why they keep it going.
I would like transsexualism to be defined as an intersex condition but I just don't want someone like you holding the reigns defining who qualifies.


I have actually never read anywhere where anyone that is gender variant was described as transsexual.  I have read them described as transgender which under its umbrella does include gender variant individuals.  I guess it may happen but nobody in the "real" world gives a shit about that.

I find it funny that someone would call me hysterical for pointing out widely known facts, and adding my own observations to them. That is another thing the sexologist “operatives” like to do. People like Hontas Farmer and others have been (crudely) employing that technique for years and it gets less effective each time.
In fact her sight listed as the Fact site is interesting but is in reality a site that would provide counter opinions to some of Aria's rants so I gather she only rad what supported her view.  Myopic but expected. Hontas Farmer is a tool if it even exists and yes you are hysterical and that is not hysterically funny but "Chicken Little" hysterical.       

At this point it should be pretty obvious to anyone born ts who Liz is, based on our own experiences. I’m not going to waste any more time with someone who is so arrogant and condescending that they would call Lisa and I “animals” in the title of a post.
Wow coming from the person absolutely nobody knows anything about that is quite a comment. I guess I must have made up my Benjamin appointment card and the other items. Just who am I then??


It was a metaphor you nitwit and I was not calling you or lisa animals primarily because it might insult the animals of the world. (That was a joke by the way)


Nobody who went through what we did would look down their long nose at other women with that kind of a superiority complex. We’re dealing with someone who seriously thinks they are better than the rest of us. That’s one of those things to look for when you sniff out these fakes too; they just can’t help it because they have their own psychological issues, usually sociopathy. That’s why they weasel their way into areas where they can have power over vulnerable people. It’s sickening.


 Wow here we go with some more dynamite in the water. Again anyone that reads this blog knows I do not consider myself better than anyone. I am not the asshole trying to set up an exclusive transsexual club for me and my friends like you are where you choose who is transsexual because you are the "expert". That is just so typical of you.  Poor Aria the martyr who fights the good fight against the evil doers that are trying to claim her womanhood like if she really was a woman that is possible.

so·ci·o·path

[soh-see-uh-path, soh-shee-] Show IPA
–noun Psychiatry .
a person, as a psychopathic personality, whose behavior is antisocial and who lacks a sense of moral responsibility or social conscience.

I think that fits you better than anyone I have met online.

I find it amusing you consider me a fake when I have been far more open about myself than you have and have provided relevant documentation but then this is the main arsenal in your weaponry against dissent. Accuse them of being frauds. Somehow try to link them to someone like a Hontas Farmer and hope it sticks. Even for someone like you that is quite pathetic.

If you would like Aria I could provide my profile of you. The only possibility of a fraud in this conversation is you Aria and the only chance of a fake  is you Aria. In my mind it always comes down to who you really are which is a mystery. People can see who I am or was but nobody has a clue who you are.

9 comments:

Anne said...

I am opening this letter to Aria, here on your blog, because she has again placed me into her moderation file, no doubt because AGAIN, open criticism is not allowed, EVEN when is offered in GOOD FAITH.

I am beginning to lose all hope of reaching Aria and mitigating the HARM that she is doing to the CAUSE of all "classic/true/real deal" transsexuals.

She really does appear to be arrogantly myopic.

annierose55 says: Your comment is awaiting moderation.

December 4, 2010 at 3:42 am

Insight? No. Observations, perhaps. Wisdom? Perhaps, but more likely just more observations and perhaps even a bit more perspective.
I have watched with interest and some amusement as your current nemesis, Elizabeth, (Liz), has been relentlessly ripping you a new one with her scathing verbal assaults, and like many others I wondered at her merciless level of ferocity.
Your comebacks and retorts, while brave, have failed miserably to even come close to even the slightest of defenses. So yes. you were totally outclassed and wisely withdrew.
I bring this up not to further humiliate you, nor publicly gloat, nor to throw salt into what must be some painful wounds. I bring this up to highlight, what I consider to be the error of your ways.
Aria. You are a brilliant writer with an obviously gifted intellect. That you, like many others, have come to acknowledge your true nature and taken those very difficult steps to reconcile your body, your physical morphology, to WHO you really are is a testament to your indomitable spirit and I sincerely salute and congratulate you.
What I would like to impart to you is just a suggestion which if heeded might allow you to move beyond what many consider to be just angry and somewhat -phobic rants to more focused, better organized and more easily read, understood, and elucidated essays.
Let me start with an example. This statement…” there is currently a campaign to erase true transsexuals from the books and replace them with effeminate gay men and transvestites.”, while fundamentally accurate is dripping with angry homophobia, as well as a poorly veiled “dig” at Elizabeth. Why not just call a spade a spade and state more accurately, “transgender” or TG?
Another example, your second paragraph…”When I pointed out that transsexual children (reproductively male) are not effeminate, I had a specific purpose in mind. While it is true that these children displayed little outward sign of the true problem, that is because by that point the window of opportunity for observing them had passed. There is no data at all on true ts children prior to this wall of silence. At the point the child is being put to the question by a cold, authoritative figure, the child has withdrawn from the world and you will gain no insight into them whatsoever. You other TS people will understand why this is so. Others can just guess.”
To begin with, your initial premise is flawed in that while not ALL TS kids are effeminate, SOME, clearly are. Then you state that you had a ‘clear purpose’ for making this statement, but then you don’t tell the reader what it is. Instead you wander into a possibly true paradigm, leaving the reader guessing unless of course they are “true transsexuals”, who of course suffered that exact same oppression that you apparently did.
So here is my point. Rather than try and fight older people like Liz or me or even CassandraSpeaks, just because we are older and possibly wiser. Why not at least considered what we might have to offer. We most certainly do not hold the “keys to the kingdom”, nor do we claim to be a source of wisdom, but we just might have traveled this path before you, and we just might know a thing or two that you or your readers, might find useful.
Offered in good faith, Anne

nobody said...

"Elizabeth, (Liz), has been relentlessly ripping you a new one with her scathing verbal assaults"

Very good Anne. I'm glad you "slipped" that one in. The rest was unnecessary if you were trying to be diplomatic, and to put that message on Liz's blog, it seems somewhat supercilious.



Anyone have a cigarette?


kisses


nobody

Elizabeth said...

June,

I am happy you have found a new home with Aria but beware of who you lie down with.

Tell your knew Inuit friend I will be posting an expose about what a complete and total fraud Aria is from the fact she thought she was a transvestite trending towards transsexual when she started on the internet. Heck you are 6 or 7 years longer post-op than that fraud. She was everything she screams about and hates so much. The only "true" thing about Aria is she is a "true" fraud. She will not be outed because I would never do that but the truth is beyond belief.

I will make sure she knows what you said about her also but then Aria is a very forgiving person and now that you have a new home you can go there and stay there and stop trolling my blog every 2 hours looking for something to comment about.

You can be a good nobody over there as long as you are a nice pet. Post one of your hate filled rants over there and see how long you last.

Liz

nobody said...

You're a bully Liz. You created these blogs because of the hate, ignorance, and internal conflict that impels you to be what you are. Those things certainly do not make a good woman, nor any form of person with enough compassion to be able to reason before acting. You act like a spoiled brat that always gets her way....if she doesn't, she kicks, and screams until she does. Do what you wish. You should be old enough to realize that what you are doing is wrong, but you just don't get it yet. I feel sorry for you....better said: "I pity you". :(

Elizabeth said...

June,

I have never bullied anyone. I am the one that has been called every filthy vile name in the books by you and your new friend.

I do not consider myself an expert on anything but I will express my opinions and if they bother you then read the blog.

Aria has denigrated a lot of people and has said horrible things about many people when in point of fact she is what she hates. Do you remember what she called you?

I would appreciate it if you could show me one single thing on this blog where I tried to bully anyone. Be my guest because expressing an opinion is not being a bully and I don't hate anyone and that even includes you and even Aria but it is time for Aria to either tell us about herself which she refuses to do or face the consequences. She could give her age, when she transitioned, how many years post-op, etc. but she refuses because she knows the truth and the truth describes a total fraud and someone whose not a very nice person. Are you afraid of her true self?

Are you afraid of the truth and I am not talking about your vile misplaced comments but the truth about someone that promotes hate and claims to have been fighting the transgender menace for 20 years which is crap.

I would appreciate it if you didn't say the vile things you said in an earlier comment and I have no issue with you commenting on my blog but stay away from the homophobic remarks is all I ask.

nobody said...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullying

nobody said...

Specifically:

"Cyberbullying
Main article: Cyber-bullying
According to Canadian educator Bill Belsey, it:

...involves the use of information and communication technologies such as e-mail, cell phone and pager text messages, instant messaging, defamatory personal Web sites, blogs, online games and defamatory online personal polling Web sites, to support deliberate, repeated, and hostile behaviour by an individual or group, that is intended to harm others.
—Cyberbullying: An Emerging Threat to the Always On Generation[56]
Bullies will even create blogs to intimidate victims worldwide.[57]"

nobody said...

Look in the mirror Liz.

.

I have a habit of removing posts that I have made, but I only do it when it becomes obvious that the site I post them to perpetrates hate. I don't remove things because I am embarrassed, but bewildered, and at a loss.

I wish you well...really. You ought to find a better outlet for your feelings, and your story.

Publish a book about your life.

In the context of a blog, a person's writings can be misinterpreted, or the person writing the blog can make statements that contradict their own previous words. There is no upcoming "moral to the story, and the "summation" of the story is only in the overall content of the bloggers intent.

You started your blog by bashing someone who blocked you from "her blog". You can't expect that a blog which was begun with hate to be productive, or to promote any kind of good end result.

I made an attempt at being a friend, but that got lost in your own need to push the Aria issue too far.

That is not what I am about. Aria is human being like anyone else. She also has a right to her opinions. Aria is strong, and will persist being the person she is. She doesn't need to tell everyone about every aspect of her personal life.

We all get to be the summation of everything we've experienced in life. We are all unique. It does not make us bad just because we have our own personal opinions that irk others.

I wish you could address the commonalites, rather than the differences. It wouldn't hurt to suppress some of the hate. ;)

Elizabeth said...

June,

I don't remove things because I am embarrassed, but bewildered, and at a loss?

You wish me well...really??

You attempted to be a friend but it got lost in my need to push the Aria issue too far??

This is not what I am about?

She doesn't need to tell everyone ever aspect of her personal life?

What is wrong with you June?

I want to thank you for the idea for my next post. You will be front and center and its star so enjoy.